Loudoun County sheriffs investigate 11 year-old national security risk
Va. Boy’s Defiant Words Draw Police Response
What Yishai Asido lacks in tact he makes up for with directness. His response to a school instruction to write a letter to a Marine was to state “I wish all Americans were dead and that American soldiers should die”. Seeing as this came from an 11 year-old would your first inclination be “immature reaction” or “national security risk”? If it was the latter, you share company with some of Virginia’s finest.
When the two plainclothes Loudoun County sheriff’s investigators showed up on her Leesburg doorstep, Pamela Albaugh got nervous. But when they told her why they were there, she got angry: A complaint had been filed alleging that her 11-year old son had made “anti-American and violent” statements in school.
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Albaugh described her son as a rambunctious student who has long opposed armies of any kind. He refused the Veterans Day assignment and told his teacher that the Marines “might as well die, as much as I care.” Whatever was said, the words had been the source of anguished conferences, phone calls and, ultimately, a day of in-school suspension.Albaugh thought the whole thing was resolved in school until Investigators Robert LeBlanc and Kelly Poland showed up last week. What followed, she said, was two hours of polite but intense and personal questioning.
They asked how she felt about 9/11 and the military. They asked whether she knows any foreigners who have trouble with American policy. They mentioned a German friend who had been staying with the family and asked whether the friend sympathized with the Taliban. They also inquired whether she might be teaching her children “anti-American values,” she said.
This is spooky, specifically the parts about “American policy” and “anti-American values”. I am against quite a few of our current policies (the systematic degradation of states’ rights and rampant legislativism of the federal government being high on the list) and my values are diametrically opposed to what many in authority believe. Take this site for example. It exists solely because I believe Zero Tolerance policies are foolish, improper and immoral. The fact that these policies litter our schools shows that my values do not toe the line. Does that mean that I am teaching my children “anti-American” values?
“It was intimidating,” she said. “I told them it’s like a George Orwell novel, that it felt like they were the thought police. If someone would have asked me five years ago if this was something my government would do, I would have said never.”
The investigators were reassured that there was no actual threat but I disagree. There is a threat to our kids and to us. This was an eleven year-old kid mouthing off. What kind of teacher needs to escalate that out of the classroom? What kind of school administration suspends the kid? What kind of principal reports this to the police as an actual threat requiring investigation? Finally, what kind of police department investigates a threat based on agreement with policy and “American values”.
The threat here is very real but it has nothing to do with national security.
(Tip credit to Emma)
Great post! I agree. An 11 y.o. kid is not worth the hype. He’ll probably change his mind 50x before he turns 18 and even if he doesn’t, if he’s against all armies who can complain about having another pacifist in the world?
You know my speel. Get a lawyer and sue.
What eleven year makes those kind of comments? The “I wish all Americans were dead” rhetoric is the same as that which is espoused by zealots responsible for terrorist acts throughout the world. At the age of eleven, he has to be hearing it from the adults at home. I don’t think this is an issue of wasting time investigating an eleven year old. Clearly law enforcement was investigating the home life to see if there was a connection to terrorism. I usually agree with Jim on almost everything. Not this one. (I think there is a lot more to this than what is in the presss)
How can you excuse this Dan? Let’s look at it another way - what if this had happened to the teenage plaintiffs in Tinker v. Des Moines? What if, during the Clinton administration, some
kid had his family investigated for mouthing something about a gigolo in the Oval Office, or perhaps some criticism of gun control policy that sounded vaguely militia-like? No, this is classic Hitler Youth tactics - use the kids to get to the parents. It doesn’t MATTER what he’s being taught at home. It’s the parents’ right to pass on whatever values they want to their kids, unfettered by government.
The greater question is what was the teacher doing giving out that assignment in the first place. It’s blatantly unconstitutional for her to require them to write supporting letters to the troops, not to mention, how would you feel if a teacher required your 11 year old to correspond with an adult stranger? Do you think
just because they’re a soldier, they’re automatically appropriate pen pals for your kids?
This kid displayed exactly the response I would want my child to give if required to do something so blatantly outside the scope of a public school’s authority.
Hi,
I am the mother of that kid…he never said the things that they claim he said. When I was brought into the school more than 5-6 days after the incident in question, I was faced with what I thought was aneed for a thesaurusus so that Yishai could more state his opinion in a more appropriate, academic way. I was shocked to have found out that he had not even been told that he was under any consideration. The last time had been for not saying the Pledge…which he has not done since 2nd grade. (I have 4 kids- 2 do, 1 varies with the mood, and I does not…I support them all.) They labeled his behavior as hatemongering to which i verbalized great dissent. We agreed to disagree and to bring in Yishai to talk…for the first time for them. I told tem that we could all get a giggle once he left at the innocence of his spirit that is searching and should be commended and guided…not punished. He came in to retort his views on environmental issues effecting Loundoun County, vegetarianism, pacifism. He genuinely is in the space that if you pick up a gun, you need to be ready to bear the consequence of being shot… a little black and white, but he’s 11 and has a point. We have more than a few times counseled him on the unkindness of his words.
But this went on and on…they agreed verbally not to add in the hatemongering stuff…but they did and in writing. I went all over the administration of the school tolerating their veiled threats which empowered me…no intimidate. They did take out the hatemongering stuff, but added in the quote that never was said and stood there. Yishai did one day inschool suspension…we thought that was it.
The local CID arrived more than 2 weeks after all of this was said and done…they investigated us, not Yishai. They clearly told me that they were not investigating Yishai…he was not suspected to go postal and cloumbine out in school. I asked these questions directly and got a direct answer. They stated that they were investigating a report that a Middle Eastern family had a son making Anti-American and violent threats in school. Call me liberal, but I could not just beg for mercy based on being the preferred nationality in the Middle east so I let them ask their questions until they asked exactly where my husband country of origin was. I was blown away when they really got in there and asked the most costic questions. They never said the school reported us, but it had to be them when they started rolling into our friend that had visited in the summer.
Maybe I should have just slammed the door in their face, but I am so liberal that I patiently answered their questions and quelled their fears. We are not particularly anti- anything. We actually feel that anti- energy can be better spent pro-something.
ask away if you would like to know something…
Yes, dweeb,
I brought up that if we, the adults, went and back tracked that we had to start with the mission statement that aspires to cultural sensitivity. Considering the diversity of the society surrounding Metro-DC, could we have not chosen a more open assignment within a public school setting? This was considered a poetry assignment by a teacher who has a brother overseas. I asked her and the administration to consider the anxiety that my young son felt as he approached this assignment. What if there were Iraqi nationals in the class…Muslims…others who just do not believe in might is right stuff (Quakers…they are accepted as american, yea?) Was his comment blurted out just like that? NO, he was coerced and seduced by a well intended teacher who thought she could help him come around by encouraging him to speak out his feelings with no repurcussions. Only after other student’s and their parents’ complained did the school start to do something…Yishai had no idea that his teacher would betry him like that after telling him that he could say anything.
Never once did his teacher offer him the stated behavioral warning system and policy stated actions…it all got very inflammatory. I questioned that Yishai seemed to display the same disinhibition that the teachers were guilty of…grossly exaggerated vocabulary to define ideas.
Dweeb,
Just out of curiosity, what if the child had, 3.5 years ago, been muttering something about his father taking flying lessons and talking about “Death to the infidels”?
While I clearly recognize the problem with the teacher assigning such a project for their students for all of the reasons you pointed out, that isn’t the issue at hand. These comments could ENITRELY have been indicative of a family situation where terrorist actions were brewing. At this time the government NEEDS to be vigilant in investigating such concerns. But, all things considered, the child should NOT be punished.
Furthermore, I do not simply reject the actions of the government, out of hand, because they didn’t find any terrorist ties. Considering the environment John Walker Lindh came from, I cannot just excuse the family situation as innocent, either.
Pamela, I suspected this was taken out of context in an emotionally charged debate. Many of us believe the goal of education is enlightenment and guiding the community to civilized conduct that prevents war. In a time of war, I could understand the adminstration discussing the pain families of the enlisted experience, with your son and in your presence. I think you would agree it was not a comment you would have made yourself and it does not serve Yishai’s goals of non-violence. Zero tolerance means teaching by legislation instead of words or intelligence. A stranger you may never meet will make decisions based on public record and today’s social climate.
The teacher could not have been objective in the assignment, and was not a good match for a foreign student who was already in conflict with war. However, the school administration will defend teachers as social authorities and vigorously pursue the power of administrators to legislate moral conduct. They believe they are creating a better school by eliminating any issue that disrupts the environment, like a rambunctious student (probably his biggest problem).
This could become much more vicous and emotionally devasting, be careful. Get a lawyer, and consider a private education for Yishai.
I think this could have been solved much easier had the teacher given Yishai an alternative assignment based upon his views. Maybe she could have asked him to elaborate his viewpoint or to explain the differences between what the marine is experiencing versus what he is experiencing.
But…. alas, that did not happen. The teacher could have gotten better insight into what Yishai actually meant, helped him develop his writing skills (which I can only assume was the end goal), and help him to more clearly define his beliefs by writing what he thinks.
Dweeb, what isn’t unconstitutional to you?
This is a perfectly normal and understandable assignment, and if a student had a big problem with the mission of marines, he should have been given an alternate assignment. After all, education should be about education, not about seeing if you can write about marines or not.
Dweeb, the military is a part of our government, and many marines are risking their lives right now. I (and you I suspect) would have no problem with the students writing a letter to the president, or a congressman, or school board member (hey Jim there’s an idea), so why not a marine?
Dan, he is 11… kids say unconventional things, and this teacher doesn’t seem to have known how to handle him.
(from Meet the Parents)
Norm: You threatened that stewardess with a bomb.
Greg Focker: No I said I DIDN’T have a bomb.
Norm: But you said bomb.
Greg Focker: What is wrong with saying bomb on an airplane?
Norm: You can’t say bomb on an airplane.
Greg Focker: Bomb bomb bomb bomb, bomb, bomb, bomb bomb bomb. During the war I was a BOMBadier.
Nothing wrong with the assignment and nothing wrong with what the kid wrote. But spare me the blah-blah-blah about the kid expressing a moral/political position. He scribbled the verbal equivalent of a nose booger. Interrogating the family is Stalinesque; the school district and police definitely crossed the line.
It was never debated that what Yishai said…no matter the exact words…was appropriate. He served his in-school for what we phrased for him as unkindness. How can a parent lecture hypocracy to an 11 hear old? We have long discussed the concept of bringing honor to oneself, one’s family, one’s community. We have spent endless hours with a child who is very intelligent with mild LD and ADD issues explaining the “right” to free speech and the responsibility of using this respectfully. Honestly, Yishai is at a provocative age…and on top of that he just doesn’t get his effect on others consistantly. His level of anxiety was very high this day. The alternative assignment to work on a monthly writing project that he was utterly lost with did not ease that…the exact opposite, he was nervous that his peers would see that he was not as smart as they were.
My only point with this was how out of hand this really got…meetings that ended in a Pink Floyd void with administrative blankness staring back with the sole expectation of compliance as I discussed the concept of thoughtful awareness as the precurser of good citizenship. Only litigation and the avoidance thereof was on the table. All this was overkill considering that this was a middle schooler we were discussing!
After the meetings that we had, there could have been no doubt that the problem was understood. In my opinion, this happened to teach us a lesson to take a dissenting stand against the school system. They have never claimed responsibility for the report to the police, but I assure you that they are happily basking in the compliments from parents who feel somehow protected by the investigation that the school never initiated.
Why can we refer to the French in the nastiest way in general conversation without being redirected? It has turned out that their objections in this war have been true! They sounded completely arrogant and bull headed as the “evidence” stack up to hasten the drum beats of war. What a moment it was! Time stood still as the evidence piled in to convince us that the potential for hidden weapons of mass destruction was obvious. I felt frightened for my children and relieved that our government did not have its blinders on! That is from someone who could never have imagined feling that way…and it was all BS and hype. The shift to finding other ways to justify getting rid of Saddam was so interesting to view…and so obvious as well. He just asn’t a nice guy so it was so easy to build the case. But is that what America is all about? What about Sudan? What about N.Korea? How about China? Why did we not invade to help South Africans years ago?
I married into a nationality that was very threatened by Saddam. Scud missiles still haunt the children of Israel. People have bomb shelters built into their home that are equipped to deal with chemical attack. My husband said if The Americans are stupid enough to spend their energy and money…and human power…like this, let them. This is probably protecting Israel on some level. As much as I have the need to do that, I could never ask my neighbor to donate her son or daughter to that cause unless they knew what they were fighting for and still wanted to.
Call me an idealist, but I want our kids home now…Powell knew that this was going to get difficult. How to leave a country in shambles with people who have lived under tyranney and corruption for as long as they can remember? I do think that this partly the zinger that imfamed the school…and the people who read the paper. Yishai reference to Amercians (if he said that at all) was a third culture kid way of speaking abut one of his passport countries. He meant and gestured at no threat to anyone.
As for the thought that Yishai’s attitude could come from a terrorist’s home, I have travelled and lived abroad for many years. I can assure you that terrorists would never permit the kind of open thought and free speech that we encourage in our home. The child you are looking for is one who does not stand out in a crowd…good student, quiet, meets classroom and school expectaions without requiring redirection. The statements and stuff I deal with would blow their cover and make them less valuable. I told the police that as well…
After reading Pamela’s comments, I have to wonder how Yishai has been treated in school in general. Often students who are perceived as different (in any way) are picked on and made fun of. If he DID make any comment about all americans dying, I would be curious as to if he has any friends. If he made a comment like that, yes, it should raise alarms - that maybe they should conference with the parents about him seeing a counselor or talking to whatever doctors he’s seeing already (I’m assuming that with AD/HD and LD, he has at least one).
Yes, Yishai has friends and is generally well liked by his peers. Since when does having a different point of view stop a kid from having friends?
Teachers usually grow to love him…he is a diamond in the rough. There is nothing more gratifying than working with a child who responds to interventions!
As for the schools, he did fine in elementary school with the firm guidance and advocacy of a wonderful VP- Edith Tordiff. She had the wisdom to be an educator. However, the transition to middle school has not offered that human and wise touch. It feels as the land of law and order. I have heard of complaints from other parents prior to Yishai attending there this year. I wish I had listened more closely. The administration of his current school needs serious help. I feel that it is a sick system.
I often felt that this area (which I technically claimed residency in since 1979 or so) is soooo conservative. If my children achieve “fitting in”, I am not sure they would be people I would like. I pray that I will accept my children for who they are no matter their choices.
As for DR., there is no point in a shrink if you have no intention of trying meds. The therapist we have seen does not see Yishai as meeting criteria for a diagnosis. Yishai has sibs with IEPs and does not want the label even if it could guarantee him some help. He has always managed with good teachers and a good mom.
I wasn’t trying to say that he didn’t have friends. I had friends and still got made fun of.
As for seeing a shrink…if you can find one who’s willing to try things other than meds, there could be some benefit. Having parents that are willing to deal with you and support you is always a huge plus (I know I would have failed many more classes than I have without my mommy).
A point to remember in this one: Kids views are heavily influenced by their parents. If an eleven year old is making these statements, then it is in the interests of the state to see where he is developing that viewpoint- either from possibly terrorist tied parents or from listening to Democrats and Dan Rather.
I can’t help but wonder. If the letter said ‘I hate muslims and wish they all would die’, would an investigation have taken place?
Nope.
Why?
Because in today’s society, those are ‘good american christian values’.
buncha hypocrites.
It is fascinating to me that an eleven year old’s words (misquoted as they were) could casue “the state” the need to investigate for potential terrorism…put that aside. We have received a real letter of hate mongering along with a typed and signed threat of bodily harm to my husband. The letter is profane and extremely racist. The police today told me that there is no crime in this because it was in writing and because it was a conditional threat. What does that mean? The condition that my husband must first walk out the door of our home before he gets “beat the shit out of.” I have pushed to have a peace bond set because I genuinely fear a person who goes out of their way to contact us by mail and threatens …only addresses the letter to my husband due to his nationality and refers to our family as “vermin infested.”
Go figure that this is less investigatable as a viable threat…his words were targetted and threatening, but not quite enough to get the average police response in Loudoun County
is your husband middle eastern?
you know that it’s only a credible threat if it affects dubya’s ‘chosen race’, i.e. - white christian sheep.
yes, he is from the middle east…Israel. He is Jewish of Moroccan parents. When the police ask if they had the right house because the white face that looked back at them offered a little cognitive dissonence…I could not buy the easy card and say “well, yes, but we’re Israeli and Jewish…not the middle eastern non-preferred kind.” I just said that i suppose some people might categorize us like that and please come in.
As for the hate mail we received, the police and commonwealth attornies tried to convince me it was not racist…vermin infested family, c—su—ers, killers,…please do not look at me and tell me that this is not racist. They did go to the home of this guy…supposedly he is a little nuts. He chopped down his post box with an axe and that’s why he uses a PO box for mail…very reassuring! Hopefully, that will be the end of it. Everyone has a right to their opinion, but no written specific threats, please.
yes, he is from the middle east…Israel. He is Jewish of Moroccan parents. When the police ask if they had the right house because the white face that looked back at them offered a little cognitive dissonence…I could not buy the easy card and say “well, yes, but we’re Israeli and Jewish…not the middle eastern non-preferred kind.” I just said that i suppose some people might categorize us like that and please come in.
As for the hate mail we received, the police and commonwealth attornies tried to convince me it was not racist…vermin infested family, c—su—ers, killers,…please do not look at me and tell me that this is not racist. They did go to the home of this guy…supposedly he is a little nuts. He chopped down his post box with an axe and that’s why he uses a PO box for mail…very reassuring! Hopefully, that will be the end of it. Everyone has a right to their opinion, but no written specific threats, please.
As Yishai’s Aunt and long time Loudoun County resident, I’m greatly embarrassed by this county’s reaction to his so called statement. Yishai wanted to be with his friends at Belmont Ridge…a lovely thing! I’m one of the many who warned Pam that he may not “blend” a highly ultra conservative administration. Please note the teachers are overall fine. My experience for the most part has been OK. They really do not take the time to understand a child’s mind. This is unfortunate. May be just an issue in a larger school environment. Pam and I were both spoiled at Sanders Corner.
To the individuals who keep stating depression issues, ADHD, blah blah. You do not know this child. Please do not pretend you can read one article and jump to such conclusions. As a daughter of an ADHD child and yes, at times on meds, this probably had little to do with it. Put your self in a stressful situation, even as an adult. Do you react at your best? Are you able to keep your mouth shut or do you find your self making statements that just do not come out right?
I’m thrilled Yishai has two parents so devoted to raising this unique child. I’m honored to know Yishai. I love watching all Pam’s children grow!
Laura
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I worry that a lot of you are scrutinizing the child a lot more than the actual problems. When I was 11, I dont think I was either too stupid or underdeveloped to develop a moral or political opinion (and digging up some essay’s I wrote for assignments and contests, I think I’m right about that. I’ve changed my mind about a lot of it, and a bunch of my views were ininformed, but logical and decently articulated based on what I knew). I was also a smartass, and a lot of really stupid things have come out of my mouth, but telling my friends dead baby jokes didnt mean my parents actually had a blender full of them at home, nor does saying that I wished all the bullies in the school would drop dead mean I would have actually done anything to make it happen.
All I have to say is just be a good parent; use your best judgement, and if you feel that your bias might put major blinders on your ability to see a problem, find help from someone familiar with your son, or someone trained in this kind of thing. Get a lawyer, see about filing a complaint about the police for negligence if the crazed man bothers you again. I would recommend getting better protection for your family, but living in Mass., I know first hand how riduculous weapon control laws can get in these states, and to be perfectly blunt, I dont think anyone even remotely connected to the Middle East can buy anything more dangerous than a pocketknife in Bush’s America without a good amount of scrutiny. (I’m joking about that last part. At least, I think I am… God help us all)
And if the police hadn’t have investigated, then you all would be pointing fingers at them when the kid blew up a school full of Americans. Any threat to anyone needs to be investigated ALWAYS. And two weeks later they investigated? I am certain it was when they were notified. Not their fault the school took that long to notify them.
My friend was murdered when the prince william police thought it wasn’t worth their time when someone threatened to kill her.
@held hostage: he did NOT say “Death to the infidels.” that was NOT his line of thinking. Bug off. The kid is 11, and has a slightly overmature, if misguided, view of the world he lives in. He calls it as he sees it, and everyone balks that he could have the audacity to say something generally toward discontentment with american soldiers.
The only thing that I can see to point out is that he is generalizing. All american soldiers can die.
Some of them are jackasses and idiots, but they should not die.
What do you think about all this, Pamela?
that little punk should be publicly hanged from a flagpole, [profanity] pan faces.